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Post by sleepswithdafishes on Feb 9, 2011 9:30:32 GMT -5
I see Doug Nelson The owner of pete the moose and hundreds of Elk etc. is back in the political news!! I have mixed feelings about this whole situation ! I know Doug through a mutual friend and he has given me a tour of his game ranch up in Irasburg. Its really something to see!! He has put an unbelievable amount of time and money into this ranch!! Thursday of this week I will be in derby at his restaurant and will talk more with him about his plans ! I do know he is very passionate on this subject as are a lot of other people Im wondering where people on this forum stand on this topic? Sleeps
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Post by buckshot (Ben) on Feb 9, 2011 15:45:26 GMT -5
I personally don't like to see big game fenced in! let them roam , there not cattle. Pete should be put down and fed to some hungry folks.
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Post by bomber on Feb 9, 2011 16:36:18 GMT -5
I'm against the special law they passed for Pete the moose. Moose shouldn't have names, their not people.
Let Pete go back into the forest.
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Post by vthunter79 on Feb 9, 2011 17:47:05 GMT -5
This issue is the proverbial "can of worms" when it comes to wildlife management.
My biggest gripe about this whole issue is why is Doug Nelson so special that he is above the laws that everyone else in this state has to follow? There were NEVER supposed to be whitetailed deer inside his enclosure but there are. There were NEVER supposed to be moose inside his enclosure but there are. Why wouldn't it be ok for the group of guys I hunt with in Milton; if we decided to enclose the farm we hunt on? Thanks for the free deer Vermonters.....we'll do with them what we want! That is essentially what the legislature has allowed this man to do; and it is absolutely not right.
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Post by luckydevil on Feb 10, 2011 15:05:36 GMT -5
Well said. He is profiting off of "our" deer and moose.
The whole irony in the save Pete fiasco, is that he will eventually be hunted and killed, only Nelson will pocket a lot of money for him. So he has not been saved, he has just had his sentence delayed!!!
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Post by fishinmachine on Feb 10, 2011 16:41:32 GMT -5
penning the animals is wrong,"hunting" penned animals is wrong,the whole idea of these game "farms" is wrong,,,what kind of a person would want to shoot a penned in animal for "sport"..I grew up in Vt. with a long hunting heritage and have taken 40 some deer but they were all free ranging wild animals,,not this pay to hunt baloney, this should be outlawed in VT.,,Maybe on a 40,000 acre ranch in Texas, but even there I wouldn't do it
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Post by vthunter79 on Feb 10, 2011 18:37:12 GMT -5
I'm not going to pass judgement on the right or wrong of hunting inside an enclosure....it's a personal decision that everyone should make up their own mind about. Some will choose to, some won't; if it's legal it's legal. The issue here is; according to the BFP, Doug Nelson intends to sell hunts of deer and moose inside his preserve. Deer and Moose that belong to Vermonters. Sleeps.....not sure if you'll see my post before chatting with Doug or not....but I'd like to know if that's true....or an assumption made by the Free Press.
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Post by sleepswithdafishes on Feb 10, 2011 20:17:41 GMT -5
Just got back from derby ! I spoke with Doug at length about his future plans .He will fight the state as long and hard as he can!! As I said in my initial thread he is very passionate about this!! I asked him and he is aware how most hunters feel about his ranch! I dont want to say he doesnt care about how the hunting community feels he just doesnt share the same views!! I dont know if most people realize besides the whitetails and moose he has many exotics and elk and buffalo!! He also pointed out that 32 other states have similar setups like his. I personally would not hunt in these inclosures !!!!! But many people do! vthunter yes he allready sells hunts for deer but I am not sure about the moose!!! So it looks like this will be a topic of heated talks for a while to come!! Sleeps
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Post by vthunter79 on Feb 10, 2011 21:21:53 GMT -5
Not exactly sure how I feel about someone "taking" wild deer from Vermont; enclosing a fence around them and then selling them. This becomes "sticky"......can a person offer guided deer hunts in Vermont? If you can he'll be able to use that as his defense. If you cannot; I'm not sure how he's legally able to sell whitetailed deer. One thing I'd like to know is of the 32 other states that have these type preserves.....how many are inhabited by whitetailed deer that the owner didn't pay for. I've been to a similar facility in Quebec (as a tag along, not a hunter). It had elk, exotic deer, boar, rams and whitetails. The largest difference being that the owner BOUGHT all the animals that were inside his enclosure. His whitetails were bought from a farm in Ontario and trucked to Quebec. My impression is that Doug Nelson has "attained" his whitetail population by simply enclosing it within a fence. If I'm wrong please correct me. One things for certain......this issue goes well beyond a single moose.
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Post by vthunter79 on Feb 11, 2011 6:39:39 GMT -5
Shummy is sticking his nose into this one too (pun intended)......seems as though he intends to "pardon" all the wildlife inside Doug Nelson's enclosure and then change the law so no one else can take ownership of wildlife. Sounds like Shummy is playing both sides of the fence here.....he must be trying to keep as many votes as he can from both sides of the aisle. I'm dissapointed that we clearly have different classes of citizens in this state. Those who have to follow the laws; and those who only have to follow the laws they want due to the depth of their wallets.
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Post by sleepswithdafishes on Feb 11, 2011 6:42:55 GMT -5
vthunter as far as I know you can offer guided deer hunts in vermont! Last spring the vt legaslation made doug the sole owner of the whitetails and moose in his enclosure!! Those are his words!! And I believe you are correct this issue goes well beyond a single moose!!!Sleeps
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Post by inthewoods on Feb 11, 2011 8:10:00 GMT -5
My solution is put Pete and the rest of the moose in a zoo. Take all the whitetail in the enclosure and allow the 13 deer farms in the state (if they want) (no hunt parks) to populate their farms with these whitetail. This will allow people and restaurants to buy local whitetail meat which could actually generate some interest in hunting. You can buy whitetail meat from other states and local restaurants are using locally raised fallow deer and elk. Letting other deer farmers have whitetail lets the rest of Vermont have access to this whitetail herd which is already partially domesticated.
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Post by maefly on Feb 11, 2011 8:53:11 GMT -5
Time to put the genie back in the bottle. We cant reverse the damage that has already been done, we can only manage it. To many complicated issues here. And then there's the anti's that have made this a crusade for their own reasons. There is no way that a solution will ever be found that will keep everybody happy, all we can do at this point is manage the mess and insure it never happens again. I propose the following 6 steps to resolution...
Step 1 - Tell Shumlin to stay out of it. Step 2 - Tell Susan Bartlett that this is not the way to push your animal rights agenda...next time mind your own business. Step 3 - Tell the legislature to repeal the law you passed last year then go about your business destroying our economy and driving anyone with a conservative bone in their body south. Let the biologist at F&W do their job without your interference. Step 4 - Tell F&W to grant Nelson a waiver, allowing him to keep and manage the native wildlife that now reside behind his fence in any way that does NOT include pay to shoot. He can keep them as pets. He can not release them, and he can not import any more. He can shoot them himself, he can invite friends to shoot them, but he can not charge. Step 5 - Send the legislature a reminder to NEVER LET THIS HAPPEN AGAIN!!! Step 6 - FIRE BARTLETT!!!
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Post by sleepswithdafishes on Feb 11, 2011 9:56:40 GMT -5
Gary all of your points are well taken!!! Although I cant see 2 of them happening 1 nelson wont back down and shumlin wont mind his own buisness!!!! I might be wrong but history has a way of telling the future!!! Sleeps
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Post by mug21 on Feb 11, 2011 17:12:37 GMT -5
Pretty sticky situation here, but when I hear "Pete the moose" I think tourist dollars. People make tons of money off of champ and no one is even sure if that thing even exists. I have no idea how you could even work this, I guess you would have to find some kind of protected, enclosed land, and give the poor guy a girlfriend or 3 for goodness sakes. Put him on all the websites and market Pete as some kind of iconic Vermont animal. Put him on hats, tee shirts, postcards, start a pretzel factory and make "Pete's Pretzels" I see tourist dollars here.
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