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Post by ouananiche on Jan 18, 2011 17:06:37 GMT -5
Amen. There are way too many tournaments/derbies currently. I am all for Champlain getting the recognition that it deserves, but there is such a thing as too much of a good thing. With the growing interest in our fishery from folks outside of Vermont and New York, one can only expect the problem to worsen.
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Post by An Bradon Charters on Jan 18, 2011 18:44:18 GMT -5
AMEN, AMEN!!!!!!!! I have not fished the LCI in years. I also do not support the LCI. I believe there are far to many tournaments on Lake Champlain. The LCI may be the biggest. But the other smaller tournaments I think also do damage over time. There are countless tournaments on Champlain. From the LCI to little local Bass clubs. The problem is a small number of participants in All these tournaments large or small do not respect the resource. With the ever growing tournaments, it is going to take its toll. I use bass tournaments as my base complaint. There are more Bass tournaments on Champlain then any other tournament. The limit is 5 fish per angler on most tournaments which ties into the State regulations. To me It seems these tournaments should reduce the tournament limit to 3 fish. That right there would help the resource. My solution would be have a lottery for folks that want to have tournaments each year, with a limited number being allowed. Capt. Tony www.anbradoncharters.com
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Post by sleepswithdafishes on Jan 19, 2011 6:01:36 GMT -5
Like or not fellas the lci is not going anywhere!!! I do agree there may be to many tournaments on champlain, But I also feel that we walk a fine line when we say we should regulate them more!!! I for one think you can have all the regulations you want but unless they can be enforced there useless!! We have to do a better job educating sportsman on the impact we have on this great resource. I also think as capt tony pointed out maybe dropping the fish total from 5 to 3 would be a good way to start!!! Sleeps
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Post by vthunter79 on Jan 20, 2011 9:31:06 GMT -5
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Post by maefly on Jan 20, 2011 16:34:11 GMT -5
I usually do a good job of pissing off the bass tournie crowd when I comment on this subject...might even get called a bufoon again, so here goes... Start with the list posted on the F&G website for tournies that have VT permits. Then go to the Town of Ticonderoga site and count the tournies there that are not on the F&G list, the ones that dont get VT permits. Then do a quick search using Lake Champlain Bass as search words, and then check all the clubs from CT, Mass, NJ, NY, and count the tournies that are not on the Ti or VT F&G list, again you'll find more that dont get VT permits. It wont take long before your pushing 200 tournies a year. And then just for fun find the clubs that hold a tournie in a spiney water flea infested lake in NY one day and then Champlain the next. But there is a plus to all this madness...it keeps the annoying kayaks, canoes, and small aluminum cartoppers off the lake on weekends. And then there is the added bonus of having well fed seagulls around Ti that gorge themselves on all the dead bass floating away from the Ticonderoga launch. Ah yes, summer on the south lake...its a wonderfull thing.
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Post by salmonslayer on Jan 21, 2011 17:27:52 GMT -5
I'm with you realdrag, I look forward to fishing the LCI every year, it is fun and it a tradition I do with my father every fathers day. And we are going to fish that weekend every year whether it's part of the derby or not. The fish are there to catch. It's the only derby I join on the lake so I don't think I'm ever going to empty the fish out of the lake, but I can see where all those tournys could do some damage. I understand both sides of the debate. I don't have the answers , on this or shooting doe or how many muzzleloading seasons we should have.
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Post by An Bradon Charters on Jan 21, 2011 21:51:07 GMT -5
Great points rd, ss. But one has to ask are the tournaments on Champlain becoming a negative impact for the future? Are these larger tournaments setting the stage for anyone who wants to have a tournament on Champlain? What will the LCI do when the spring runs dry? Leahy is not going to live forever. Seems that many here are hush hush on the issue. My opinion is this approach has got us where we are today. People are scared to voice there opinions on an issue? I would have thought there wold be many more responses from at least the regulars here, no matter what side of the debate they were on. As we all know it takes many discussions and or debates to get to heart of issues. But when folks get talking and sharing their ideas, things happen. Maybe it is because of the subject matter? LCI? Once again this is not an attack on the lci, at least from my stand point . It is about hey lets look at what we have and where we are going. Is this a good thing or bad thing. Things always seem better at least when looked at in the short term. The way I see it is we are in a taxing of the resource to make up for short comings in revenue. Yes bass tournaments in general are in the sights. But looking at the stats that is logical. There are more bass tournaments on the lake then any other. Have there been long term studies on the effects of these tournaments on Champlain? NO! Reason? There have not been this many tournaments on Champlain for an extended period of time. Folks seem fit to bitch under there breath. But no one wants to speak up as it may ruffle feathers. Time to get real people! Capt. Tony www.anbradoncharters.com
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Post by salmonslayer on Jan 21, 2011 23:21:20 GMT -5
Well said capt Tony , I've been watching this thread all week, and was hesitant also to reply worrying about backlash , but then thought we all want the same thing on the end and nothing is going to happen if people don't voice thier opinions. I haven't reserched where all the money from all these tournements go, but I hope a portion goes to restocking.
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Post by schodackbassman on Jan 21, 2011 23:26:49 GMT -5
I had written a lengthly post a few days ago that went with wind when something burped and it was gone. Shorter versions/recommendations follow:
Limit tournaments to very other weekend. This gives everyone equal access to lake/public launches.
Reduce limits to three per man for individual competitions. Encourage team format which would allow for 5 bass PER BOAT like Brock's outing I fished in last year. That was fun and encourages team work.
Love to see NY or VT do a study specific to Champlain but mortality rates have been studied already on other bodies of water. Survival rates on Champlain will be the same or better because water doesn't get as warm as down south and west where they are fishing in water over 90 degrees in the summer.
I think 98% percent of bass fisherman take care of their fish they intend to release. There will always be some that don't. Also keep in mind that bass organizations were probably the biggest influence on catch and release programs of any organization. How many of us used to keep many of the fish we caught for the dinner table? I didn't keep a one this year and I know most who don't. But I know many pleasure fisherman that do keep/eat the bass they catch. Not saying it is right or wrong, just that there is more then one way bass populations get reduced.
To conclude, there are still a ton of bass in Champlain. The pressure has probably increased 20 fold ever since the first major BASS event was held here in the early/mid 90's. But so has the cover because of the weeds. I'm sure their are many old enough to remember the clay color water of the 70's and very little weed compared to now. I'd bet there are more large mouth in the southern part of the lake then there were 30 years ago. Maybe not more then 10 years ago but we are still way ahead of the game. At least down south here.
As long as we have the weed growth we have now, chances are the bass is going to do quite well. We still should do everything we can to help but I don't think the population is close to being endangered just yet. There are other issues such as behavior (much improved the past few years), the taking over of public launches, careless aggressive driving, plant/pest transport between waters, and crowding other fisherman. But I think tournaments every other weekend would help with much of this. Not going to happen, but it's a suggestion just the same.
Tight linesall. I am so looking forward to mid week fishing this year!
Brian
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Post by Raz on Jan 22, 2011 7:18:12 GMT -5
I don't have an issue with the LCI or any other fishing contest on Champlain... I enter some...some I don't. That's what the fish are here for...me, you, them...us. I care about the population of the fish. If it gets negatively affected, the tourney's will go away. But in reality I don't think that will happen, I don't think the population of targeted species will be severely effected.
I care about the "state of the lake", its condition, its future. It's a vast wonderful resource that needs taken care of and protected by us, the users of the lake. Fisherman.
I share some of the same concerns Schodack has expressed. -behavior -over-crowding of public launches -crowing of other fisherman -careless aggressive boating -invasive species -phosphorus loading -improved/increased spawning areas
Buy a Vermont fishing license. Go fish and have fun.
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Post by bomber on Jan 22, 2011 7:43:15 GMT -5
I agree that tournaments could become a problem. I think the bigger problem is fishermen not doing any catch & release but catching their limit when ever possible. If we want bigger fish, we've got to return some of the smaller ones to the lake. We only keep a salmon or laker if someone on the boat wants one to eat that day or the fish is not going to make it. Going home with a cooler of fish to put in the freezer and never see again isn't the best policy.
Captain Bill Birch
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Post by An Bradon Charters on Jan 23, 2011 17:26:46 GMT -5
Great points everybody. I hope the ideas and points of view keep coming in. If the rest of the world could think like the responses we have got then these tournaments maybe would/may not be an issue. It just seems to me the way things are now is bring in as much money as you can and we will fix the problems if any later. Running a charter business I also have an effect on the resource. We encourage catch and release of fish. but also give our clients (who are all licensed the option to keep what the law says they can if they choose). We also expose in my opinion, many more first time fishermen and women to the sport and will see the benefits of there taking up the sport in the future as well. As Razzle said it is about having fun and enjoying the sport. When your not in the money in a high stakes tournament, I cant believe that is still fun?? Capt. Tony www.anbradoncharters.com
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Post by in t h e o f f i c e on Jan 23, 2011 17:52:14 GMT -5
I agree that tournaments could become a problem. I think the bigger problem is fishermen not doing any catch & release but catching their limit when ever possible. If we want bigger fish, we've got to return some of the smaller ones to the lake. We only keep a salmon or laker if someone on the boat wants one to eat that day or the fish is not going to make it. Going home with a cooler of fish to put in the freezer and never see again isn't the best policy. Captain Bill Birch I believe the strict interpretation of the law means you can only have two-days' limit in your possession...just sayin'. As far as LCI or B.A.S.S being bad for the fishing. Hmm. I think the bass can take it but I am not sure the lake nor the boaters can take it. If we can let bass keep the environment like they have now, I think at least LM and smallies can out-produce the current level of "demand" on the fishery. Other species, particularly salmonids, not so much. I have wondered if people would rave over the size and quantity of our smallmouths if the take was "less." Would this give us a plethora of small-ish fish? Or would they grow 'til they crashed after eating a couple season's year class of bait in one summer? Would other fish crash as a result? I wonder these things sometimes. There is also the idea that we welcome attention to "our" lake that tourneys and TV bring. But TV shows call Champlain's bass fishery one of the best in the country! And yet the perceived take goes up... B.A.S.S needs to do a little image cleanup with dead bass after tourneys, but only a few of these tourneys are BASS- most others are am's and semi-pros. 200 tourneys seem a little much. At the same time, I am not sure I can in good conscience say that LCI is specifically bad for fishing.
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Post by schodackbassman on Jan 23, 2011 18:09:58 GMT -5
Are tournaments fun? Not sure I'm qualified to say as I've only fished one in my life just this past fall. It was a small club tournament involving members here and I have to say, I had a ball even though Bob and I were no where near being the money. The good hearted competition, busting balls, and challenge was fun. Not a whole lot of money involved which I'm sure makes a difference but I can see where folks enjoy the events. I play golf tournaments too for the same type of fun.
I'm not speaking for or against tournaments in this post, just saying they can be and are fun. I'd do it again and probably will. At least I'd do it in smaller club type of fishing events where the emphasis is on competition and having a good time.
My two cents worth.
Go Jets....
BD
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Post by An Bradon Charters on Jan 23, 2011 18:42:14 GMT -5
Just wanted to add in case there was confusion. I said That in the BIG money tournaments it in my opinion would not be fun if one was not in the money. The smaller tournaments, where it is about just having fun such as the Salmon shoot out would be the model and type of behavior I would expect. The guys in the past two shoot outs are exactly the type of GREAT SPORTSMAN, I was referring to. They know what they have, they appreciate there resource, And are just in it for some fun, Not $$$$$. I still ask the question what will happen when Champlain is no longer deemed "suitable" for the big money tourneys which bring in money? Can the lake keep up with the demand? I do not think so! But I can not say for sure as I do not have any hard evidence to the contrary. Do I want to gamble on it??? No Thanks. Keep the discussion going everyone. Once again I just want to make people aware and am looking forward to responses. As I have said talking things through solves issues. Capt. Tony www.anbradoncharters.com
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